Welcome to Episode 74 of Published. In this episode, editor Lindsey Clark will describe the causes and symptoms of burnout and ways to recover from it. She will also explain how to manage stress and lean on others to prevent creative burnout altogether.

00:28 – Welcome back to Published. For creative people, the work never stops. Even when you're away from the writing desk, you're never safe from an epiphany in the shower or a brilliant thought you have to scribble down before you fall asleep. This only becomes more complicated for authors developing a book. Now suddenly, there are deadlines to manage, events to schedule, designs to choose, marketing, copy, and social media captions to write, often all on top of another job. Because it’s so difficult to escape work and the stressors that come with it, writers are especially prone to burnout. Beyond slowing productivity, burnout is harmful to mental health.

01:17 – Lindsey, welcome to Published. I'm excited to talk to you today. Tell us who you are and what you do at Greenleaf.

• Absolutely. So, my name is Lindsey Clark, I have always loved to read and write, and I have always had a passion for all things grammar. I actually got my start on the other side of the book publishing business working at two of the best and most reputable independent bookstores in the nation, Square Books and Oxford, Mississippi, and Lemuria Bookstores in Jackson, Mississippi.
• Then my career path took a turn. I've been with Greenleaf as an editor for almost a decade now. I have edited almost or over 250 books in some capacity. And I edit at all levels. So, I can do proofreads all the way to manuscript development. And what I love about my job is being a part of getting an author's content out into the world and into reader’s hands.

02:12 – And full disclosure, I'm happy to say that Lindsey was probably the main editor on my book. So, thank you, Lindsey. Very gentle editor, I will say.

• And it was my pleasure, you were wonderful to work with.

02:41 – We're going to talk about creative burnout today, which is certainly a real problem, especially for an author facing something as daunting as writing a book. I'm sure you've seen this many times with the authors you've worked with. How would you define it? What does it look like? What are some of the things that can cause it short term and long term?

• Creative burnout is basically a state of exhaustion, that can occur around creative work, no matter what creative field that you're in. What was once a creative outlet that brought joy becomes a daunting task that brings dread.
• For authors this looks like hitting a creative wall, they become overwhelmed by what they need to accomplish, the mere thought of writing stresses them out, and it manifests itself physically.

Most authors also have a full-time career, whether they're CEOs, business owners, teachers, accountants, or whatever. So, they're trying to put in the necessary time it takes to write a book while also working full-time.

• Burnout can be caused by setting unrealistic goals as far as producing content and being faced with unreasonable deadlines they have often set for themselves.
• Some of the consequences of burnout are:
  • Number one, the quality of the content you're producing can suffer.
  • And then there are the physical and mental consequences that can be either short-term or long-term, depending on how and when you address the burnout.
  • If you don't address it, you may feel increasingly hopeless and helpless.
  • The negative effects may spill out into every area of your life. So, at home, at work, with your friends socializing, you carry it with you.

04:28 – Yeah, so clearly a very important topic to discuss because we would hate for anyone to slip into that state. It's like a death spiral.

• Yeah, it affects your mental health, for sure.

04:40 – Now we hear people talk about writer's block all the time. And creative burnout, in my head, that's a level beyond writer's block, but can you speak to the differences between those two concepts and maybe how an author can identify which state they're in?

• Burnout is definitely more intense. Writer's block is all in your head, you go to write, and the words just aren't there, they're not coming. It's generally easier to get over writer's block than it is burnout. If you just kind of take a step back, read over some of your past written material, take a walk, or listen to music to get inspired, you can really get over writer's block easier.
• Burnout, however, manifests itself both mentally and physically and it's more extreme. If you're experiencing burnout, you're likely feeling excessive stress, fatigue, insomnia, sadness, anger, and irritability. Impostor syndrome is another sign of burnout. I mean, we all experience stress and fatigue. And we all have nights when we can't sleep. But if you have burnout, the dial on these symptoms will be turned up, and there will be a noticeable difference.

06:12 – And I think another distinction might be, I'm no psychologist or anything, but I think that with writer's block, your heart is still there, it's just you're having an off day. It's kind of like you go to the gym, and you think that you're going to have a fantastic lifting day and your body is just probably preoccupied doing something else that you don't know about. And it's like, okay, today is not my day. But your heart is still there, and you're in it to win it. You're going to try again. And with burnout, there's just no drive, you've just resigned yourself to I don't have it.

• Yeah, yeah. It's the hopelessness and helplessness. You're like, I just, I can't do this. I physically cannot do this.

06:54 – Let's say, unfortunately, our imaginary writer subject here on this podcast is burnt out. What can someone do to come back? Can you come back from burnout? How can they dig out?

• Absolutely, you can come back from burnout. And the first step to doing that is recognizing the signs and realizing that is what it is. You need to accept that that's what's happening instead of just trying to continue to push through.
• And then the next thing, take a break, step away from the content, and let yourself rest. And if you can, do some self-care.
• When you're ready to return to the project and kind of start writing again, maybe change things up for kind of a reset, like change your environment that you're writing in, or change the time of day that you're writing, from morning to night. These little things that you can do to switch things up can offer a reset and kind of bring maybe a fresh perspective to what you're trying to write or what you're trying to do.
• Another way to come back from it is instead of trying to be a writer, be an editor for a little while, go back to the content you've already written and change, and make adjustments. This might inspire you to move into writing new content by going back and looking at the stuff that you've already written.
• You can also reduce the pressure by reevaluating your writing goals and demands. Maybe they're not realistic. And that's why you're feeling so much pressure. Make sure your goals are attainable.

08:32 – Yeah, I think also I would say, go back to the why, right. I think sometimes if we stop and remember what sparked a fire in us in the first place to undertake this very large task, that can be a big motivator and can maybe reignite some energy.

• You can even go back and read something that inspired you to write in the first place. Maybe you're writing a business book, but there's a fiction book that particularly inspired you to be a writer. Read some of that and see if it causes you to get reinspired about the passion that you had in the beginning for your subject.

09:17 – There's a lot of hype and celebration when people know that you're writing a book, it's a big deal, right? So, I would imagine there's a bit of shame, right? If you realize you're not making progress, you're feeling this burnout. And I think you and I would agree it's important for someone in that state to let their loved ones in their lives know that they're struggling. So how can they do that in a way that still feels empowering to them or doesn't feel like they've thrown in the towel to make sure that they are cluing in everyone around them perhaps that they need some support?

• I think it's important to know when this happens that it happens to, I would say, pretty much every writer, at some point. Taking on the task of writing a book is huge, it's a giant thing to accomplish. And most writers are going to experience burnout. So just accept it. And there is no shame in that.
• I would say just go ahead and speak up, be completely honest with yourself, and those around you. Another great way to help get over burnout is to socialize. So, if you let the people know around you, your family or your friends, what's going on, they can help you. Ask them if they'd like to go for a hike or get a coffee and don't talk about your content at all. Just be in the moment with them and let them help you take your mind off the task at hand. Thereby alleviating some of the pressure.
• And then if you're working with an editor or a writing coach, let them know that you're experiencing burnout, they've for sure seen it before, and they’ve probably experienced it as well. And they will surely have tools in their toolbox to help you get through it.

11:15 – Yeah, awesome. Now, obviously, this doesn't sound like a fun experience to anybody. So how can we avoid burning out in the first place?

• Knowing that it is a possibility when you go into the writing process is big. So, when at the outset, set attainable goals from the beginning, maybe go ahead and schedule breaks in your project. Be aware that you're going to need to step away from the content as you’re writing from the outset and make it part of your plan.
• If you've worked with me in the past, I'm going to sound like a broken record here. Here's another reason that having a solid outline is so important. If you have an outline in place, you can move around in the content more freely, and focus on the content that you're feeling inspired by and passionate about on any given day. So, if you've been writing in chapter two all week, or whatever, and then you wake up, and you're like not feeling inspired about those topics anymore, move to chapter six instead and write about that.
• I think having an attainable plan in place, from the beginning, where you have breaks scheduled, and then having a really strong outline that you can move around in the content are two really great ways to prevent it.

12:41 – That's great advice. I love the idea of scheduling in some gaps, some spaces to take a break, because you and I work with a lot of go-getters, and they come in and it's a race to the finish for no real reason.

• Absolutely. And that was something I was going to talk about, it's a careful balance. Because when I have manuscript development authors come into the process, they are so gung-ho from the beginning. And you have to find a way to ride that momentum. And yet, be sure they're realistic about how much content they can produce in a given timeframe. So again, setting attainable goals from the outset is of utmost importance.

13:27 – Yeah, great. So as an editor, you specifically, as we've talked about, have seen this, and dealt with this with your authors. Just speaking to the editor-author relationships, I suppose a lot of our authors are working with an editor, how does an editor specifically address the topic of burnout? And how do you start to spot it perhaps with your authors? What are the red flags? And what do you do at that point?

• When we begin this process, we have a plan right in place, and we're going to check in every so often. And we're going to try to hit this goal of a number of words and you know, take it in chunks.
• And some signs that I see is that they will say oh, I can't hop on a call this week. Let's push it to next week. And then the amount of content begins to dwindle. And so those are some red flags for sure that it's happening.
• And I will bring it up and say ‘Hey, how are you feeling about writing? Is it stressing you out? Are you having any of those physical manifestations of burnout?’ And if we talk through it, and I can tell they are, what I tell them is I say, ‘Let's take a break. What do you think you need? Do you need a week? Do you need two weeks? So why don't we check back in two weeks and see how you're feeling?’ Because I really do think the best thing to do if you can and are not working on a deadline is being able to take a break and step away from the content for a while.

15:17 – Yeah, I agree. And I suppose there will be some people listening who are, for various reasons, unable to take that break. And I think I actually ran up against this when I was writing my book. And you and Nathan generously came in and sort of rode shotgun writing a couple of sections. I just, every time I sat down, I hit a wall. And I was like, ‘I don't want to,’ being a stubborn little brat. And my brain wouldn't let me go forward. And it was an exception in our process, but one that I needed to get over just the mental hump of ‘Here are these sections I don't want to write.’

• Well, that's really the great thing. If you're going to write a book, the advantage to having a writing coach or an editor walk with you through it is when you get to those places where you're like, ‘I'm just not feeling it. I don't know what to write, I'm not feeling passionate about this.’ Your writer or coach or editor can give you prompts and say, ‘Hey, let's write about this for a while.’ Or they can frame it in a question that you can just answer the question instead of having the pressure of having to come up with it all by yourself. You have that support there.

16:40 – Exactly. I think that's super helpful for anybody who's, unfortunately, not enjoying the flexibility of a moveable deadline.

• Absolutely, which I experience as an editor, I do creative work. And there's a lot of writing that it entails. And when I do feel overwhelmed and I’m feeling a little bit burned out, and I still have to meet my deadline, I know that just sitting at my computer and trying to force it, I'm just going to be sitting there all day, and it's not going to get there.
• When I'm experiencing that if I can take a walk around the block, or run down to the coffee shop and get myself a treat and a cup of coffee, get out of the house for a second, and then come back and actually pick up my computer, take it to the backcourt have my little treat there, it's kind of hit a refresh, and then you know, I can make it through and hit that deadline.
• And then I always reward myself at the end of the day when I've hit that deadline with a nice glass of wine and go to bed early. Because I cannot stress the importance of rest when you are feeling burnout. Reward yourself with those little things that are going to help you get through it.

18:08 – Yeah, you said rest and you were talking about going to the coffee shop and doing this, that, and the other and I'm thinking I would just take a nap.

• That might be what works for some people. You know that's what I do for me, get myself a little treat. If you need to lay down for 20, 30 minutes, an hour, and take a nap, do that.

18:31 – Well, I assume some folks who are listening to this today maybe googled it and are experiencing this creative burnout right now. What is your advice to those people?

• Back off, give yourself the time you need. Read something that inspires you, perhaps something that inspired you to want to be a writer in the first place. A book that I always recommend to my manuscript development authors is a great book that actually provides tools for preventing burnout. And it's Bird by Bird by Anne Lamott. Have you ever read it?

[Tanya: I have, I was given it when I had burnout.]

• It's so good. It's a guide to how to become a successful writer by taking things one small step at a time. And instead of focusing on the bigger picture, which can be overwhelming, you're just taking it one thing at a time.

19:38 – I love that. That's a great recommendation. Yeah, I'll make sure that's in the show notes. Well, this has been super helpful. I hope that we've been able to be a resource to some folks who are experiencing this. It's not unusual, as you mentioned. Any parting thoughts or words of wisdom for our listeners?

• Sure. If you're a writer experiencing burnout, it's highly likely. It's totally normal. If you begin your writing project with this knowledge and you're aware of the signs of burnout, you can recognize them when they begin and go ahead and take steps to alleviate burnout before it gets too bad. Go ahead and take that break. It's a big thing to take on. But if you take it Bird by Bird, you'll be successful, for sure.

20:27 – Yeah, I think one more piece of advice that I would add, just having gone through the experience is, if you can visualize the end, if you can imagine that moment where you open your box of books for the first time, and you lay your hands on this thing that was vexing you for so long, it's this amazing accomplishment. That moment is so powerful. I think being able to turn to a mental image like that and sort of live through it can just give you a boost of adrenaline and it's going back to the why, right? Like, the payoff is there.

• Yeah. Keep your eye on the prize.

21:08 – You got it. Well, Lindsey, thank you so much for joining us today. You were great.

• Thank you so much for having me, Tanya. This has been a pleasure.

That's it for our episode today with Lindsey. We hope you enjoyed learning about creative burnout and how to manage stress. For notes and resources from today's show go to greenleafbookgroup.com/episode74. You can also find advice for writing, publishing, and promoting your work in my book, Ideas, Influence and Income, which you can learn more about at ideasinfluenceandincome.com. If you've enjoyed our show, please rate, and review us on iTunes, Spotify, or wherever it is you listen to your podcasts. It means a lot to have your feedback and helps us make sure we're answering your publishing questions. A big thank you to Eleanor Fishbourne and Madison Johnson who produce the Published podcast and we will be back next month with another episode.