Today I’ll speak with Greenleaf’s Digital Media Outreach Strategist, Sam Ofman, about book publicity and how it has changed in recent years. Sam will tell us about the impact a strong PR campaign can make for an author and their book and how you can get started on your PR efforts.

01:05 - Why don't we start by having you tell us about yourself and what you do here at Greenleaf.

• Well, first and foremost, I am a new dad!
• Professionally speaking, I've been in publishing for about seven years now. Before I was with Greenleaf, I worked for a pair of independent publishers as a publicist.
• Now, I am a digital media outreach strategist, and my job is to help authors raise awareness of their books and develop their digital presence to help the entire book’s campaign.

01:58 - For people who are not familiar with publicity, can you give us the baseline understanding of what publicity is, how it helps an author, and how it's different than marketing?

• For me, publicity has always meant earned media. It’s up to you to convince media members that there's value in featuring an author or their book.
• In terms of how it can help authors, there's a few ways. There's the direct idea of publicity where you're raising awareness, gaining exposure, trying to generate word of mouth all in the effort to drive sales.
• But there are ancillary benefits too. There's an element of cachet and pride. You feel like you’re a more legitimate author when you're doing that show that you've always wanted to be on and there's value in that.
• For nonfiction titles, which we do a lot of here, there's value in publicity that's not related to sales. Authors often want to develop their own brand and be featured in particular news outlets for their own career’s sake, so there's a lot of potential there as well.

03:48 - One of the things that I often tell authors when we talk about publicity is that there's a push and a pull that has to happen to sell books, because books are sold returnable. So, the push is usually from our distribution team to get books out into retail and listed everywhere, but when they're in brick and mortar, sitting on shelves, we need the pull of publicity to create a second sale from a consumer to move those books all the way through the sale process and not be returned. So, publicity, in my opinion, is very important in the beginning, especially as we have a lot of books out in the trade, to avoid them being returned and create a pattern of reordering and some momentum around the book launch.

• Absolutely. And then, in that immediate period around the launch when you're trying to make that initial pull, a lot of authors will set up events, and publicity can be a great way to leverage those and drive more traffic and foot-traffic to signing events too.

04:53 - Now, a lot of authors that I speak to are hesitant to hire a publicist, because it is not an inexpensive venture, and they are not convinced of the benefits. They're looking for an ROI typically on book sales and since we can't guarantee publicity, we can't guarantee any ROI or placements for that matter. So, what would you say to that author? Have you seen publicity impact book sales specifically, and how would you convince them that it was in their best interest to make that investment?

• I would tell them that it's worth it because it's not going to happen on its own. If you wrote a book and you're proud of it, you owe it to yourself to give it every chance to succeed.
• I've had clients who see huge spikes from an interview or an influential tweet or any great plug, so you know that the value exists—it happens all the time. But the goal is, like I said, not always sales.
• When I was in traditional publishing, I worked for the publisher—they own the rights to the book, so it was in my best interest and my company's best interest to sell books. My publicity efforts were all geared towards sales or that's how the company wanted it to be, but I also have a tendency to take the author and their goals and make them my own goals which is much more aligned with what happens at Greenleaf.
• So, here, selling books is important and every author wants to sell books, but if their main interest is using publicity to establish their brand or generate new clients, then I'll make that the goal of my campaign, and we’ll focus more on outlets that will help them achieve those ends.
• If you send out a press release and somebody glances at it or they hear you on a radio interview or podcast, they may not buy the book, but two years later if something you said sticks in their mind, they might look you up and they might be a new client. Maybe they want to hire you as a consultant and suddenly you have a 20-year business relationship that you would never have attributed to your publicity efforts. It's that auxiliary, long-term effect that publicity can have that you don't really see up front all the time.
• I understand the hesitancy and it is incredibly difficult to quantify the return on investment but there are times where I've had extremely successful media campaigns with national syndicated shows and the sales just aren't there. Maybe there's breaking news that drowns you out or the market is oversaturated.
• There are other factors at play, so there’s not a one size fits all answer. You have to understand what's best for you and how you can tailor the campaign to be as effective as possible.

08:03- You said something very important in there that the book's not going to sell itself and I wanted to add that there is the danger of any author falling into this trap of magical thinking as I call it, and I did this myself when I wrote my book Ideas, influence, and Income. You get through the difficult process of writing it and at the end you think you can just sit back, and magic will happen and like you said, it does not work that way. Luckily, I realized you have to do what everybody has to do when they launch a product which is support it and get the word out. That's another thing for authors to bear in mind as they approach that decision.

• I actually self-published a book recently which I wrote just for fun with no commercially viable aspects to it, and I did the opposite of what I would tell any author to do. I have no platform, I put no effort into it, no money into it and I said, “let's just see if this organically triggers the Amazon algorithm—you never know.”
• I think I sold 8 copies to my mom and that's about it, so take it from me, it’s not going to happen on its own.

09:25 - Now to give our listeners some context, you mentioned your title as a digital media outreach strategist, and we've talked in passing or we will at least about traditional media. Can you explain what we mean when we talk about traditional publicity versus digital?

• Traditional PR is broadcast TV, AM/FM Radio, print journalism, newspapers—things that existed before the internet, but these days every traditional format has a digital addition, whether it's finding the local NBC affiliates morning show clips online. Even the smallest community newspapers have some sort of online entity, so the lines are certainly blurred.
• But the difference, to me, is that consumers of traditional media aren't searching out those online entities. Let’s say you're watching Good Morning America in the background every day on TV, if you miss an episode from last week, you're not going to go search it out online the way you would with a podcast that you are a loyal listener to.

11:21 - I think one of the benefits that sometimes is overlooked with digital, and particularly with podcasts like this one, is that there's a transcript so there is this digital footprint that's left for the long term versus a more fleeting TV interview or radio interview that doesn't have a lasting tail.

• Perhaps the main takeaway of my job is the idea that digital media is evergreen. It's not going away. It's there forever. It's shareable, it's discoverable, and that's the unseen value of most of Greenleaf’s marketing and DMM campaigns. It’s providing those lasting, authentic, high-ranking backlinks.
• So, even though the talk radio might put out their podcast version of today's episode, it's not worth as much because far fewer people are going to that page than they are a podcast that is meant to be found that way.

12:38 - Now many authors are somewhat fixated on this bucket of traditional media but for folks who are focusing on the old way of marketing books like TV, especially, and even book tours, what have you seen from authors who solely focus on that component of a publicity campaign at the expense of some of these more contemporary approaches like podcasts?

• I found that when I have a more experienced author, they have a tendency to want to do the more traditional book tour and want to be on the big TV shows, and they don't realize that these days, the size of the audience doesn't matter as much. Those can lead to a big sales spike but on those tours, you're not reaching people who care about your book unless you are a very consumer-friendly national appeal where you make sense to be on a show like that, but for the most part, you want to find the subculture that your book is tailored to.
• I'd rather be on an interview with 300 people that really care and are passionate about my subject matter than 300,000 that won't buy it and might be interested in it for five minutes. There's not as much value there as there is in finding those 300 people that will all want to read the book and the host has read the book and has interesting questions.
• Last year I booked a notable author who had a very recognizable name. He did all the local TV affiliates, all the big radio shows, had features in both the daily newspapers and barely sold any books. At the same time, I was booking a campaign for a virtually unknown writer who had just enough cachet to get on all these low-level podcasts and he said, “Book me for all of them.” He was willing to hustle, and he outsold the big name five to one in his initial launch week.
• So, if you can get on the NPR national segment or you can get a review in the Wall Street Journal, do it; it's going to be helpful because certain audiences are better book buyers than others. But overall, everything should be phasing into the digital space, because you can really segment and target exactly who you want to reach.

16:12 - You mentioned something else important in terms of the resistance, sometimes, to do some of these smaller shows or to think, “I don't want to do that podcast because it doesn't have very many listeners,” but there is a follow-on effect. I have a background in media and television production, and I know from working in that world that a lot of times the media is looking for evidence that other people have paid attention to something before they consider it. So, if you think about it that way, in terms of rationalizing the time investment in some of these smaller programs, it’s because they can lead to the bigger programs.

• I say that to our current authors who are engaged in the podcast outreach program. I ask, “Do you have any shows that you think you would be a good fit for that might be receptive to hosting you” and they answer with the number one podcast in America or the biggest possible shows.
• I say, let's start with trying to land five to ten of these more niche targeted podcasts and then when we go to pitch them a month from now, we can point to this history of strong interviews and see that they are an expert, have interview experience and built that presence to where they Google your name and see ten media interviews right away. That helps enormously when you are starting out.

18:03 - In terms of what is effective in the digital media space, there's a lot of growth here in the digital side of things, what would you say to an author trying to figure out where to put their time? What is the most effective trend?

• Everything has skewed towards platform. It's a matter of, more so than the content of the book, how many followers does this person have? That’s the most powerful tool in my opinion—that kind of connection and being able to leverage those relationships.
• But the way everything is so segmented and targeted, you can really find audiences now that are exactly the people you want to buy the book, so the trend that I would like to see more of is focusing on that.
• And when I say targeted, I mean, if you did a book on advanced baseball analytics, there are outlets where you would reach thousands of people who are extreme baseball nerds, and you make more sense focusing on those five key websites than you do going on ESPN and talking to casual baseball fans because the casual fans aren't passionate about it, they don't identify with it.
• The people who identify with the subject matter, who feel it’s a part of them, they're on those five sites—they’re the ones who are going to buy the book.
• It's really a matter of finding the online, searchable, evergreen, targeted, shareable content, and when you have those outlets sharing it, the people who are in that community, they see you featured on those pages, and they know they can trust you. It’s a matter of understanding who you’re looking for and how to find them.

20:21 - What about timeline? I think sometimes authors get caught by surprise at how long or how far in advance they really need to start thinking about publicity and then choosing a publicist so what would you advise on that front?

• There are two ends to this spectrum.
• Yes, they're often surprised that they might need to start talking to a publicist when they're still working on the manuscript so they can really put a plan together. If they want to do a lot of long-lead media and in-depth stories, some of these podcasts book six months to a year in advance. If you're looking to get involved in the book trade, some of them have four-to-six-month lead times, so you need to work on that strategy well ahead of time.
• But often, I find authors who are so eager to get started that we have to tell them to hurry up and wait. You've done all the work, you've got this book, you're ready to start promoting, but in doing an interview five months before a book comes out, people who hear it aren't going to be able to find your book because it's not going to be on shelves. There are dangers on all sides.
• I think the trend is a little bit more towards short lead. One thing that's nice about digital compared to print is, sometimes, there's not as much of a lead time concern with deadlines and you don’t have space limits. So, if they have a good story, they can run that excerpt or Q&A and if you can get them the materials and replies quickly, it can be the day after you reach out to them. It really depends on the project and the outlets.
• I would say when it comes to announcing your book in any pre-publication and letting your own network know, I would talk to your publisher first to see what they recommend and what timing they approve of.
• If you're worried about alienating your followers, you know better than anyone else what your network is going to tolerate and whether you could tweet at them every day or space it out every two weeks. And for the person you're working with, if they know you and they know your book for your audience, they can advise the best way to do that too.

23:26 - This is a relationship heavy part of our business, so how would you suggest an author set themselves up for success in terms of working with a publicist and then landing media placements?

• You need to be responsive, and you need to be on top of things. If you get an opportunity and I reach out to you with it, it helps to have a reply, even if it's letting me know when you are free or when you can get back to me on it so I can keep media in the loop. If I pitch someone and they say yes, and I don't get back to them for a week, they're onto the next one because they're getting a ton of pitches so when you have a chance to schedule something, you must prioritize it and you have to stick to it.
• Another aspect is you need to be ready to shamelessly promote yourself and call on your friends and your colleagues and ask them for help. Leverage your professional relationships. Call in all the favors. And some people aren't comfortable with that, and some people relish it so knowing in advance that that's going to happen can be helpful.
• Another tip would be doing your homework. If you are going to be on a podcast or you're going to be doing a feature with a journalist, listen to the show, read a recent article, think about how you can steer the conversation back towards your topics. And even practice your replies out loud so you don't trip over your words. Have your top anecdotes ready to go for interviews and be ready to repeat them over and over again.
• Otherwise, I would say, build your platform and that's something you have to start well before a publicity campaign. You want to have followers who trust you and care about what you have to say before the book comes out.
• Having a platform and having people who are interested in what you have to say and will listen to you when you put out new content is extremely valuable.

27:06 - Alright, let's talk about books that have already been released. Some of our listeners may have already had their pub date come and go. Is there any way that they can revitalize their sales using publicity? Is there any opportunity there for these authors whose books are already out?

• There is. It’s usually not as easy of a pitch but, if the content or the author has something relevant and topical, there’s certainly no reason not to pitch them for stories.
• A year ago, when the Black Lives Matter movement kicked off, there was a lot of interest from journalists for relevant stories on social justice and I pitched several excerpts from backlists titles from my old company and saw some really successful hits.
• You have to find creative ways to connect the title or the author that you’re looking at to whatever is happening today. A lot of authors don’t realize that when you’re pushing the book, you’re really pushing them. They are the product as much as the book is and they need to see themselves that way when they’re preparing for publicity.

29:01 - I want to circle back to one thing. We were talking about traditional and digital media, and we touched upon the pros and cons of each, and I don’t want our listeners to think that we are suggesting that anybody have a campaign that is solely one or the other, because usually there is a blend. Can you speak to how you as a publicist look to strike a balance between traditional and digital?

• There’s a ton of value in both and they should be working together. It depends on the author's goals and what the audience is. Traditional is like fishing with a net whereas digital can be more like fishing with a spear, so if you have that mass appeal and you think you can throw the net out and see what sticks, that’s great. You might catch a really big fish that way, but it's tricky.
• I think of a big traditional media hit as a home run—it has immediate impact, you can win a game, and everyone sees it and talks about it. But if you try to hit a lot of home runs, you're going to also strike out a lot.
• With Greenleaf’s effort with digital media, it's more like each service is a strong defensive player and if you put them all together you get the added benefit of finding a pitcher who throws a lot of groundballs. So, you're enhancing the game in a very invisible way since you're not hitting a home run that could win this game, but you have a better chance of making an out on every pitch the entire season.
• Your book is going to be positioned better for searchability on Amazon, for getting more backlinks, and all these things add up to more wins—they may not be as flashy, but they contribute in a more significant way.
• And the best baseball teams are good at defense and hit home runs so you got to find a way to balance both.

32:30 - You’ve been super helpful today; do you have any parting advice for our listeners who are considering hiring a publicist or are anticipating launching their book and trying to figure out how to optimize that piece of it?

• Yes, authors should think about what they really want out of their publicity campaign. Very often we’ll list all the various benefits that we can try to provide, and they'll say they want all of them and the result is you end up spreading yourself too thin.
• It's beneficial to prioritize certain goals, focus on those, and when you achieve success in those aspects, you'll see a snowball effect in the other elements and a media campaign will come into focus as a result of that.
• Also, think of yourself as the product. Be ready to work. It's not that you hire a publicist and then kick back and watch the results come in. You really do need to be ready to work, be ready to answer emails, be ready to come up with ideas.
• You're bringing someone on who's going to be a coach, but you are still a player on the field. We end up working as a team.

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ABOUT SAM

Sam joined Greenleaf with six years in publicity with independent publishers in Chicago. His experience working with Hall of Fame athletes, award-winning journalists, and Grammy-winning musicians helped him develop a strong network of media connections around the nation. Sam's media relations work, when paired with his writing background, allow him to execute effective digital media campaigns that bring exposure and authority to Greenleaf authors and their books. He earned a BA in Advertising from the University of Illinois and a Masters in Creative Writing from Northwestern University.